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20 July 2015 Enterprising Investor Blog

Are Financial Advisers Supposed to Get Paid?

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For many investment professionals, the seemingly inexorable rise of robo-advisers constitutes an existential threat. The fear is simple and justified: Services now exist that provide investors with a portfolio that fits their expressed risk tolerance and reward inclinations for 0.25% of the assets invested in that portfolio.

That's comparably a great deal and thus financial advisers offering a similar service are in a tough place.

If we use the example of a financial adviser currently making $75,000 a year, one who splits their fee down the middle with their firm, we can see this pretty clearly. At a 1% fee, this adviser can make a comfortable middle-class income if they spend 60 hours a week talking to 100 or so happy clients with a grand total of $15 million invested with the firm.

If their fee were lowered to 0.25% of assets, the adviser would need to either take on more clients (and provide less service to existing ones) or seek wealthier clients. Either way, their firm would need $60 million in assets instead of $15 million to make the same amount of money. Like, duh, right?

If losing that much in fees worries you, a widely shared blog post should terrify you. Blake Ross, who co-founded Firefox before spending six years at Facebook as director of product, maintains that those already-reduced fees are astronomically high and should be closer to zero. He even accuses Wealthfront, one of the larger robo-advisers, of embodying the same "Wall Street" mentality that many find reprehensible.

So while investment professionals are staring at robo-advisers and wondering how they'll ever compete on cost, technology folks are looking at robo-advisers and wondering if they can be undercut further. I've been saying this for a long time at this point, but free investing is the new free checking. The cost of these services is going to approach and eventually reach zero.

So What Should You Do?

Enterprising Investor is written for professional investors, so it's tempting to interpret the question above from a business perspective. What should you do if you want to stay competitive?

The thing is that good business comes from good outcomes, so let's ask the question from a different vantage point. What should you do if you want to give your clients a good outcome?

Blake's argument is really simple to encapsulate. Many robo-advisers compare their fees to the typical investment adviser's 1% and argue that they are fantastic. But that's not necessarily the right benchmark to use. All fees reduce investment return, so what would happen if you didn't pay any of them?

Well, if you're able to save $5,000 a year for 50 years and invest it at a constant 6%, you'd be richer.

The more than $300,000 gap between a 1% annual fee and a .25% annual fee is striking, but so is the $125,000 gap between paying a seemingly nominal .25% and nothing. If you paid 1% a year in fees, you'd have an account that is smaller by 28.5%, whereas if you paid just .25%, you'd be behind by just over 8%.


Value after 50 Years of Saving $5,000 Annually

Value after 50 Years of Saving $5,000 Annually


And remember, that's for an account that receives regular contributions over time. For a lump sum investment, the gap is even larger.

So like, why would you pay fees? The answer you have to give is because the fees are for services that add value, right? So the only question that matters is simple . . .

Value Compared to What?

Blake's post makes the point that many of the services that Wealthfront and other similar robo-advisers provide are of uncertain or questionable value, and he may well be right. It's awfully difficult to beat a Vanguard target date retirement fund on cost.

But what is value here? What's the point of saving money? Managing someone's money well should be about maximizing their quality of life. It seems quite reductive to distill that down to the size of their bank account in retirement. Everybody wants more money, but it's not the point of existence. It's just a means to buy the stuff you need or want.

A mean-variance optimized portfolio, however it's delivered, is simply not the same as insight into what you will need and might want. It is also not as valuable. If you approach a client with a perfectly customized portfolio but fail to explain the role it will play in their life, they won't care very much. They might well become a client, but they will miss the point of the exercise and you will have failed both them and yourself.

So don't neglect the conversations that are really important when you sit down with your clients. Don't forget to ask them about what they're doing to live a good life. You should be able to have discussions about the trade-off between spending money now to be happier and saving it for later in a context that is broader than an ending account balance.

If you're willing and able to have those sorts of conversations with clients, then it'll be worth paying top dollar for your services. But that assertion only confirms that the product you provide — advice — is worth something. It doesn't tackle the question of how to charge for it.

That's somewhat intentional. How do you think we should be charging? Let me know in the comments below.

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All posts are the opinion of the author. As such, they should not be construed as investment advice, nor do the opinions expressed necessarily reflect the views of CFA Institute or the author’s employer.

Image credit: ©iStockphoto.com/retrorocket

26 Comments

WO
Will Ortel (not verified)
21st July 2015 | 1:14pm

Dmitriy --

Thanks for the kind words. I'll return them -- great thoughts. I agree with you that folks with less than 100k shouldn't pay fees, and I'm actually in the middle of laying out the reason why right now. I'm not sure about raising an asset based fee as the assets in the account rise -- as Michael notes below I bet folks would find a way around that. Age based fees are tough too, since they don't necessarily relate to the services that are provided even though they're likely to. Folks nearing the retirement age need more advice.

This means that there needs to be some other way to charge for the value-added services that you rightly note are more important as you get richer and older. I'm not entirely sure where the line should be drawn between things that cost extra and things that come with the free, but tax and estate planning seem like the sorts of things that should have standalone cost.

To your elephant, I'm not necessarily sure that the natural result of concentration in index funds would even be observable. Since active managers net out to the market, we already hold an aggregate exposure that is the same as what we'd have if we all held the same cap-weighted index fund.

I'm also not sure that a free investment account necessarily implies a passive one. There's no particular reason that active products can't be free for small investors too. They do cost more to deliver than passive products, but costs are falling in general. A fee structure that's "free till you get rich" might be a good way to build a stable investor base for a newly established active firm.

Thanks as always for reading!

Will

JA
Jeffrey Allen (not verified)
21st July 2015 | 2:31pm

The dictionary describes a commission as a "percentage of a quantifiable sum". So what is the quantifiable sum of an abstract service like advice. Might be why the national trend is if advisors ever charged commission in 80%/ 20% are diminishing commission or doing away with it.

M
Michael (not verified)
21st July 2015 | 5:40pm

"I agree with you that folks with less than 100k shouldn’t pay fees...."

Investors who do not want to pay commissions / fees can go directly to Vanguard Brokerage. It's already free. They don't even charge transaction fees, plus there are no minimum asset requirements for Vanguard ETF's. In addition, those Vanguard ETF's carry very low expense ratios...averaging 0.05% to 0.15%.

https://personal.vanguard.com/us/whatweoffer/stocksbondscds/feescommiss…

But if investors want advice, that entails time, risk, education, licensing, insurance, experience, software, hardware, liability, electricity, brick, mortar.... none of these are free.

The cost of advice does need to come down, in my opinion, but free? I don't see it.

DI
Dmitriy Ioselevich (not verified)
23rd July 2015 | 11:06am

Right, I don't think there should be strict requirements that say once you reach this age or income level your fees go up. Rather, I meant that fees would average out around the levels I proposed. I'm sure there'll be people who want more hands-on service and are willing to pay more in fees, just as there'll be people who are comfortable with a more hands-off approach. But the industry standard of a flat full-service fee for everyone regardless of circumstances needs to change.

DL
DR. LAURENCE BRODY (not verified)
20th July 2015 | 12:54pm

Great article raising great questions that time will answer.

I am no longer interested in managing money. I belong to CFALA and joined to be a better analyst of financial situations. The movement is towards managing for a fee rather that developing astuteness in financial analysis. The organization is changing direction into financial management.

My answer is from a behavioral finance perspective, and lies with the relationship between advisor and client. That is tantamount. If the relationship becomes either meaningless or lies on 0.25% of a fee, then the profession is in trouble.

Several years ago, I spoke to a health insurance executive about the importance of the doctor patient relationship and the trust between them. His answer was that the insurance industry was committed to destroying this relationship and replacing it with the patient/insurance company relationship. I didn’t see it then, but insurance has accomplished this by contractually eliminating the doctor’s relationship. And patients, well or ill, have to trust the insurance company because the doctor on the relationship is only a name on a list right now and is easily replaced, by maybe the low bidder.

So there is a lesson, and the organization of financial professionals may need an organization specific to preservation of the advisor client relationship. You can get the advice for free on the internet. But you will always need someone to tell you to get into or out of any specific market. That’s where the value will be, especially as investing becomes more global, volatile and political.

J
James (not verified)
21st July 2015 | 10:12am

This tactic has been around for a while, from dividing a husband and wife on a micro scale. And Brokers have used it to lock in clients, in case an advisor wanted to branch out, on his or her own. Now, rolling this tactic out on a macro level, could be detrimental to any relationship. At we're talking about it.

WO
Will Ortel (not verified)
22nd July 2015 | 2:37pm

Laurence --

I'll return your kind compliment: great thoughts! Many thanks for reading.

I think the problem that you're talking about is fundamentally one of recognition. Very few people on the street will talk about how their adviser/client relationship has transformed their lives.

Financial advice is not a fundamentally viral product. It somehow manages to have even less buzz than going to the dentist or doctor. And the people who buy it (at least the individuals) are perhaps even less able to tell the difference between a good and bad practitioner. Just as perniciously, they aren't necessarily able to tell the difference between a "good enough" practitioner and the one they should really be working with.

There are also fit issues that need to be considered. Like, is personal advice really right for everyone? Would I rather talk to the same person throughout my life or someone with expertise in whatever situation I find myself in?

In any case, it's not a simple issue. I'm looking forward to expanding it more in the coming weeks. Many thanks for reading!

Will

JA
Jeffrey Allen (not verified)
20th July 2015 | 3:15pm

Yes financial advisors DO get paid everyday on wall street.
Financial planner.com indicates 3 types of payments including salary..
Those who snivel about fees are those who have a sense of entitlement for something for nothing

M
Michael (not verified)
20th July 2015 | 10:34pm

People have an emotional attachment to their money. While robo-advisers offer compelling advantages, they can never truly compete on an emotional level. That's not to say robo-advisers won't change the way advice is delivered, or the cost of that advice...we're already seeing it happen. But investors will always respond to human interaction better than they will to an automated email.

Traditional advisers will adapt to the new technology, just like they did with online trading. I see the robo-adviser revolution as an opportunity, not just for investors, but for traditional advisers as well. Maybe the new model is a hybrid, where small independent advisers can partner with robo-adviser platforms instead of those costly alternatives. The money and time savings can be redirected toward acquiring even more clients and strengthening existing relationships.

AM
Anthony Miller (not verified)
21st July 2015 | 12:53am

If the services of a financial adviser are limited to asset allocation services comparable to that of the robos, then they will experience fee compression.

However, anyone with practical experience knows that financial and investment planning with individuals is more about psychology and human behavior than about numbers.

Without a personal relationship with a quality adviser, individuals make choices based on over-optimism in bull markets and over-pessimism in bear markets. They buy at the top and sell at the bottom. They invest either too aggressively or too conservatively. They miscalculate the cost of taxes. They think they will live forever when discussing life insurance and that they they won't live very long when discussing longevity insurance. They are mostly in complete denial about future medical and long term care expenses in retirement. They deplete retirement funds to give money to and pay for education for their kids. They overspend with their consumer and real property purchases. They underestimate their spending habits. They rarely revisit their debt amortization and costs. They buy cars based on monthly payments. They buy vacation homes and rvs when they would be better off renting than owning. They are subject to the whims of the things they read and watch on the Internet and cable TV. Etc., etc., etc.

A financial adviser who also addresses all the above psychological and behavioral issues more than earns their 1%. They create tax alpha, behavioral alpha, budgeting alpha, etc., etc. far in excess of their 1%. They do not experience fee compression.